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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 18th, 2008 13:32 |
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Hi,
I am a 49 years old woman,living in the Netherlands.
I was diagnosed with MS in 1997.
For five years I was on avonex, an interferon beta 1A
This probably gave me my first liverinfection, in 2005.
The avonex was stopped by then, I did not use any medication since.
The liverinfection returned in 2006, by then my galbladder has been removed.
Again the liverinfection disappeared, but has now come back again.
Bloodtest show that my enzymes are very high again.
At the time I had my second liverinfection, auto-immune cells against my liver were found in my blood (I don't know which ones)
For the last four years I always wanted to start up with antibiotics as a treatment for my MS, but always the liverproblems came inbetween.
At this time believe I should not wait much longer, but I am uncertain to start with the MP, because of my high livervalues at the time.
Some of my last values are:
ALAT: 627; LDH: 452; GGT; 140 ( I hope someone understands these Dutch interpretations)
Who can tell me if I can start with the MP?
Regards,
Annemarie
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Annemarie
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natalie17
Advocate
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Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 12:30 |
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Hi AnneMarie,
Welcome.
You're best to do some reading;
MS MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS and Th1 inflammation
My liver enzymes are elevated. Should I be concerned?
To begin the MP, you need to find a supportive Doctor. If you current Doctor is not willing to support you, you may post a request for a list of Doctor's in your area at REQUEST FOR DOCTORS LIST (click here).
Ultimately, whether you can start the MP or not is up to your supportive Doctor.
Let us know if we can be of any more assistance 
Best,
Natalie
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I can help you understand the recovery process, but only your physician is licensed to give you medical care.| ABCofMP|My Story
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 13:19 |
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Hello Natalie,
Thanks for answering.
I have read the piece under the link you gave already.
My liverenzymes are much more elevated then mentioned in that piece.
I am seeing an internist soon, he does not know about the MP.
My GP is willing to help, he knows about the MP, but is uncertain at this moment too. He wants to wait untill the internist has seen me.
I think they are going to come up with something like auto immune hepatitis.
I believe it is all Th1.
My heartbeat is irregulair for 7 years now,nothing was found by making an ECG.
I have multiple sclerosis for 13 years, my skin is often infected, especially the palm of my hands,and now my liver.........something goes around in my body and it is getting worse.
My only question is, if , with high liverlevels like I have, I can start with MP anyway.
Maybe I have to be more carefull or do something additionally.
Anybody?
Annemarie
Last edited on Wed Nov 19th, 2008 13:19 by Limburg
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Annemarie
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 18:01 |
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A list of any medications you are taking, how often, how much and for how long, would be helpful
You will need to measure your D-metabolites
When you say your liver enzymes are more elevated, have you converted properly between Metric and US units of measure? Which enzymes? What values are they, and what is the normal range for the lab you use?
Last edited on Wed Nov 19th, 2008 18:09 by Dr Trevor Marshall
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 21:04 |
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Hello Dr.Marshall,
At the moment I am on LDN (low dose naltrexon) I take 4,5 mg once daily.I'm on LDN for 2,5 years now.
I take acetylcystein 600 mg. twice daily. I take this for 8 months now, as a detox for my liver.
I take no other medication.
My last livervalues from bloodworks 1 week ago:
ALAT (alanine aminotransferase) 627 U/l ( reference <40U/l )
LDH (lactaatdehydrogenase) 452 U/l (reference 135-225U/l )
GGT (GammaGT ) 140 U/l (reference <40U/l )
Vitamin D 25 37 nmol/l ( reference 25-110 )
In American standards ; vitamin D 25;14.8ngr/ml
Vitamin D 1.25 109 pmol/l (reference 52-164 )
In American standards; vitamin D 1.25 45,4 pg/ml
The bloodworks were done in a hospital laboratory in the Neherlands, Maaslandhospital in Sittard to be precise.
Additionaly I have to mention that I have been consuming a lot of fat fish and was supplying vitamin D for about a small half a year, 15 micrograms daily) I stopped to do so 1 month ago.
I hope thiss will be helpfull to you.
Thank you already for responding,
Annemarie
Last edited on Wed Nov 19th, 2008 22:11 by Limburg
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Annemarie
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 11:47 |
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Also my vitamin B12 increased to a 1051 pmol/l (normal range 125-650 pmol/l)
This is without supplying.
I just mention this,because in november 2007 my vitamin B6 also increased to a value of 671nmol/l (normal range 35-110nmol/l)
Can it be because my liver cannot convert this vitamins?
Annemarie
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Annemarie
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 12:16 |
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Annemarie,
I have no experience with LDN. But I note that it does affect the liver and kidneys, although the degree of damage, and whether any damage is transient or permanent, are the subject of dispute.
Your D metabolites are consistent with Th1 disease, which is no surprise as we already know MS is a Th1 syndrome.
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 12:39 |
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Thank you for your answer.
I will tell my internist about antibiotics and Th1 disease, and let him make a decision if it is safe to go on the protocol by now.
Yesterday I stopped the LDN, I will not take it any longer.
I want my body clean from chemicals,at least as clean as I can get it.
I hope I can soon join this forum as a " Marshalian"
I want to wish everybody on the protocol much perseverance and lots of succes!
Annemarie
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Annemarie
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 12:45 |
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Annemarie,
I never told you to stop the LDN, that is a decision which can only be made by your physician. You need to discuss all these issues with him/her
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 13:15 |
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I see what you mean by this, that is why I already stopped taking LDN yesterday.
But I ensure you I will tell my GP.
LDN is in an experimental stadium for several chronic disease , there are some trials going on, but nothing is sure about dosage,mechanism and why it can work.
I did not know LDN could affect your organs,nobody told me, until you.
I do hear a lot about antibiotics,do they too affect the liver or any other organs?
And how about good bowelbacteria when on the Marshall Protocol?
Annemarie
Last edited on Fri Nov 21st, 2008 13:15 by Limburg
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Annemarie
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Dr Trevor Marshall
Research Team
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 13:20 |
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Well, I have no personal experience with LDN. However, if you scan some of the results from this Google search it is clear that liver involvement is not unusual:
http://www.google.com/search?q=naltrexone+liver
There is a lot of useful information in the ABCofMP
Answers to your questions on antibiotics, and probiotics, can be found there...
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 14:26 |
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In the articles I have read about LDN, it says possible liverdamage caused by LDN,is reversible, so it is safe in using.( I googled on naltrexon and liver and read the first three that appeared)
LDN (low dose naltrexon) is less then the normal dosage of 3x50 mg. a day.
LDN is given in dosages of 4,5 mg. once daily.
But I am not a professional, I don't know if small dosages can cause problems too,I will ask my internist.
I myself do not believe LDN causes my liverproblems, I believe it is a ( chronic) infection in my liver,caused by???
Maybe CWD? Auto immune antibodies against my liver were already found at the time I had my second hepatitis, I don't know which ones.
I want to ask the internist about CWD too and ways to detect it in the body,I hope he has ears for CWD and Th1.......
I want the internist to exclude other things but CWD, all I want is to start with the MP, under the condition the light is green, at least as green as possible.
I still have a lot of reading to do about the MP myself, so thank you for the links you gave me.
Thank you for your help and time also!
Annemarie
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Annemarie
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Furch
Member
| Joined: | Sun Nov 16th, 2008 |
| Location: | Norway |
| Posts: | 25 |
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Offline
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 16:32 |
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Hi anne marie
I have MS too, and starting the MP soon
I've been on LDN too for 1 year(4,5mg),
waiting to hear from my doc about discontinuing it before starting MP, by slowly reducing the dose.
As far as i read, the LDN works by antagonizing opiate-reseptors, in order to trick the body into producing more endorphins, thus reducing pain. It sure dont beat the prospect of being cured
http://tinyurl.com/5kw9h8
I assume it's possible it works on other reseptors as well, like benicar, thats not listed as an area of effect.(?)
I wish you all the best with regaining health
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Limburg
Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 22:20 |
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Hello Furch,
Nice to meet you on this forum
I took LDN for almost three years, after I wasn't allowed to take Avonex anymore.
How did the LDN work for you? For me it was a support for my bladder,less spasms,and it gave me a clearer head,less fog in my brain (or what's left of that brain  )
It is nice to meet a "collegue" here who is going on the MP.
Before I start I have to know, my liver is okay enough to deal with the antibiotics.
How did you find out about the existance of something like the Marshall Protocol?
When will you start with the MP?
How is your MS doing at the time?
Would like to hear about your experience with the MP.
I hope it works out for you!
Greetings from Annemarie
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Annemarie
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Furch
Member
| Joined: | Sun Nov 16th, 2008 |
| Location: | Norway |
| Posts: | 25 |
| Status: |
Offline
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 23:54 |
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Nice to meet you too ,there seems to be few MS-collegues here on the MP
LDN gave me a slight energy boost, but i started excercise at time so hard to say what it did to me. Have had too many problems, been on strict diet, which i belive in some way might have helped keep symptoms at bay(but clearly no the disease itself)
I found the MP through this blog:
http://www.frequencyfoundation.com/2008/08/l-form-bacteria-root-of-many-chronic.html
wich further took me to amy proal's site: http://bacteriality.com/about-the-mp/
after that click i was hooked on MP info, it all made too much sense, the next day i sent my doc an email and asked what he thought, he said it was very interesting, so here i am, completely at the mercy of the MP
I will be starting the mp next week i think, cant wait to feel the herx!
Ive long been somewhat denying my illness, dont tell anyone about it, and live like i used too. To be honest i havent been doing too well recently.. been having intense back-pain, stiff joints in my fingers/hands, and some general exhaustion. I actually started feeling a little more energized after lowering my LDN dosage, but that might be due to the optimism from having found a curative treatment, which puts my whole future prospects in a whole different perspective.
I will post as i progress on the MP, as do I hope to hear good things happening to you too
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